Revision as of 09:40, 5 November 2005

An interview with Sean Carroll

by Brendan Komala

I first stumbled upon Sean Carroll's concert artwork about nine months ago while cruising Ebay, looking for some prints for a favorite band of mine - Concrete Blonde. One of the pieces I found was a hand-pulled silk screen that caught my eye immediately - it was something that I identified with the band instantly. Then I noticed something... this was print #076 from the "Sandusky Bay Poster Works". That means that this artist has done at least 75 other prints... I'd better get looking. Since doing his first print in July of 2002, Sean Carroll has cranked out over 160 prints in a little over 18 months. Every one until recently has been a home studio, hand-pulled silk screen. And above it all, he's still just a fan of the music...

This interview was conducted over the course of 3 weeks worth of emails.

BK: Brendan Komala, interviewer

SC: Sean Carroll, artist/printmaker, Sandusky Bay Poster Works

BK: First off, where did you go to school for "art training"? Did you work in a shop or apprentice somewhere prior to beginning your own printing?

SC: We'll just start at the college education part. Graduated from the Art Institute of Pittsburgh in 1988 (or so) with a degree in visual communications. As far as previous printing experience, nada. I've done artwork for local T-shirt printers since I was in high school and over the last 6 years had been pretty much exclusively working with one printer. Designed a national line of shirts called "Bar Rags" (designs for the drinker), worked a couple of summers at an amusement park as a caricature artist (and continued to do that, as a point of record), that has been pretty much my main job for over 10 years. Had a stint at a local weekly tabloid newspaper, did a local cartoon strip for a couple of years, kind of schlepped around. So I knew the basics of silk screen printing from watching it and designing art for the process for so long, but no real experience. Rock posters have always fascinated me. Back in high school, I was always getting in trouble in my commercial art class. My teacher would always bitch and moan to do something 'non-rock and roll' for a project - always said there's no money or jobs in music for artists.

BK: Do you do your own printing or do you use a crew of help to get it all done? What kind of setup do your have at SBPW in terms of good, equipment, personnel, etc.?

SC: I do all of my own printing - every step of the process from designing the artwork, processing the screens, setting up the job, and finally printing them. I have no crew, posse, or assistants though I do have a few groupies.I have a couple of nephews (grades 7 and 9) who will claim to have helped me a couple of times. Basically, I let them print a copy of a poster or two for a show they wanted to go to. When you're a teenager, that gives you a lot of street credibility and you can talk a big talk. All pre-press stuff (screens and non-printing work) is basically done at the previously mentioned screen shop. I pretty much have run of the shop. I couldn't ask for nicer people - without them I would not be doing the stuff I am today. The production part takes place in my "shop" - my basement, the corner of it. The only piece of equipment I have that was pre-made are the hinge clamps on the press that holds the screens down. Everything is D.I.Y. My press consists of a plywood bed with 2x4 framing and rests on 20 year old speakers which act as the legs. I have about $40 in the whole get-up. It would be safe to say my set-up is "primitive". When I first started doing these posters, I had the press on the kitchen table or, on a sunny day, on the back deck. I soon learned that hot sun is a bad thing for silk screens and water-based inks. My drying rack is an old rack given to me by a printer friend. 40 shelves. Depending on poster size, I can put between 80-240 posters on it. That is the main reason my runs are so low. The very first poster I did was Pat Benatar. At the time we were in the middle of redoing our living room so we had no furniture in it. So I had a room full of Pat Benatar posters drying on the floor. I order my inks (speedball water based permanent acrylic inks) from an art supply place in Massachusetts. I get my screens and squeegees from a screen supply place in upstate Michigan. And the printer that hooked me up with the drying rack sells me the paper. I think she believes me to be a bit on the eccentric side, always coming in and ordering different paper, asking for samples of all these different kinds of paper. So far every poster I've done has been with my own hands. Coming up, I'm doing a summer concert series for a local amphitheater in which I'm doing all the posters offset - the quantity they wanted was too much for me to do myself. So that will be a different experience. It will be different to let someone else do the work and only do the designing part.

BK: How did the connections come about - how long were you designing prints and making them before you felt that it was something that could be a "real job"?

SC: I'm still not sure it is a real job. I'm putting in way too many hours at it, but still not a real lucrative business, if you know what I mean. My first year goal was not to lose a lot of money and second year was to break even. My first year (actually 4 months) I broke even, and last year I probably made a small profit, so I guess I'm ahead of schedule. My first print was for a theater that was bringing Pat Benatar to our small town (Sandusky, OH). I asked the theater director and he was like, "sure, whatever" so I did the posters, and of course he fucking hated them. So I got my first lesson in humility very early in the game. He never used them, supposedly threw them away. He was one of those pansy ass "theatre" guys, his shit doesn't stink, and rock and roll is for cretins, blah, blah, blah. Probably liked going to Riverdance type shit, he's gone now - good riddance! I had went on an email campaign in the year before, trying to get someone to give me a chance. Contacted all the local venues. The local Clear Channel guy was the only guy who answered me, and it was "contact Derek Hess". Thanks a lot! As irony would have it, I worked with the same guy all last summer, very good guy. We joked about it a lot. Anyway, I did a Warped Tour poster (SBPW-002). Planned on giving them out at the show to bands, fans, anyone who gave a flying fuck. On the day of the show, traffic was one huge cluster fuck. Ended up parking about a mile away and didn't feel like hiking to the show with all those posters in tow. So second poster printed, second poster in nowheresville. Next up was Less Than Jake. I said "fuck it, I'm gonna do it this time." Did posters, looked fucking hot, and wouldn't you know if - blew a tire on the way to the show. At this point I'm really considering maybe posters aren't my thing. Got to the show late, but took some in. Gave them to the door people and merch guy for the band. Never heard a thing. Finally got a nibble from another venue, the Beachland Ballroom. The show was Roger Clyne and the Peacemakers. They said, "If it won't cost us anything, and the band doesn't mind, what the hell!" So after emailing the band repeatedly, got the OK from them. Did the poster and band! Sold like 10 or so posters at the door, got to hang out with the band that night after the show, got rave reviews, and I was hooked. Repeated the Less Than Jake scenario with a Reel Big Fish show at the same venue at LTJ. By a weird twist of fate, I was dropping off a poster at Beachland on the day of the Reel Big Fish show, and on the way home, drove out way out of the way to go past the club. Just as I drove by, a guy walks out the door of the club towards the Reel Big Fish bus down the block. That was my moment and I pounced. I worked up all my courage, parked the car, grabbed a couple posters and introduced myself to him. He turned out to be the tour manager and was great. Offered me tickets, took some posters for the band, told me to hook up with him after the show to meet the band, etc. Dropped off posters at the door that night and got chased down the street by the merchandising director for the club, gave him a card, and the rest just snowballed.

BK: I have noticed a wide range in the groups that you do prints for - local punk, high school "battle of the bands" type things, national tours, etc. How do you feel about doing local VS. national acts?

SC: Obviously, doing a show for a national act is cool. Especially when it's someone you are really into. It's such a thrill to meet them, hang out with them, etc. I guess I haven't been in it long enough to be jaded. Before I started, I was a fan, and still am. That was part of the reason I got into it, you know. I don't play an instrument (well), and I thought this would be a great way to get into shows for free, occasionally meet some cool people, and maybe make a little cash to boot. That hasn't changed. The excitement of a national act. I'm just giddy with the upcoming Van Halen tour. When I was a teenager, I wanted to grow up to be Alex Van Halen, and now I'll be doing a poster for the Cleveland show this summer. That is fucking amazing! I'm still a punker at heart, so about half of my stuff I do is punk/ska bands. I kind of have three categories for posters I'm doing: one is I like the band, wanna do the poster cause I'm into them; second is so and so at one of the venues likes a particular band, could you do a poster for the show; and third is someone is paying me to do the poster - I may not know the band, or in some cases even like them, but the cash register is ringing. I do some local stuff, but I don't have a lot of time to do it. That's not to say I don't want to do them - there are a few local bands I like a lot and have been chomping at the bit to work with them on a poster. I did a couple local show posters that I really like. I hope to do some more local stuff this coming winter, when the national stuff slows down. So it's really a time thing. I know some people think that is a "sellout" thing, but there is a very slim profit margin for me right now, and with the volume of posters I'm doing right now (over 100 last year), I have to take a paying customer over a non-paying one.

BK: Do you do any non-show print projects? Any "fine art" (print or other media - painting, lithos, sculpture) besides your gig posters?

SC: I still do the caricature thing, especially in the summer. I live in a summer resort destination so it's all I've known for my life. I've been doing caricatures for all of my adult life. This summer will the the 19th summer I've been drawing. It's kind of funny. I haven't really exploited my caricature drawing in many posters yet. Did the Howie Day one in a caricature style, but that's about it so far. I definitely plan on doing more of that style in the future but as far as "serious art", no, not my bag. Though I have considered some landscape prints - had a lot of success with some of the posters I've done in that style, most notably the Roger Clyne and the Peacemakers posters - so that may be in the cards at some point.

BK: Your prints are predominantly 2-3 color prints from what I've seen. What is the largest number of colors you're ever used and do you feel that you'll progress into a wider range of colors at some point? Is the number of colors used in part controlled by the amount of time you have to dedicate to each print?

SC: I did a 6 color and a few 5 color posters. Throw in a half dozen or so 4 color posters too, I think. Quite truthfully, I'm still not comfortable enough with my abilities yet, and my homemade equipment just can't handle the registration to do much more. I suppose at some point I'll have to upgrade the press and then maybe I'll think more colors. I have that quandary a lot. Some posters I know would kick ass in 5, 6, or more colors but just can't do it right now. And the amount of posters I'm doing right now is quite overwhelming at times. When you've got 15 posters coming up in the next 30 days, some times you scrimp a bit. Once I get a better grip on this whole thing, I'd like to cut down the workload to a more manageable 50 or so posters a year. Plus, I think single color stuff is a lost art. I really like the old Hatch print stuff from the Grand Ole Opry. And I see some political stuff that is one color, just blows me away. A good 1 or 2 color poster can have as much impact, if not more, than a fancy 10 color one. I guess that's the "graphic artist" in me. Don't get me wrong, there are a couple posters I'd love to redo some day and put in more colors. A Reel Big Fish and a Zebrahead poster come to mind.

BK: You mentioned recently that you've been contracted to do prints for the shows at the Tower City Amphitheater (in Cleveland) this summer. How are you going to deal with the large number of shows as opposed to your standard printing schedule?

SC: Definitely going to do the offset thing. It is looking like at least 30 shows by the time it's all said and done with the majority of them mid-June through August. It would be just suicidal to try and do them myself with my little dog and pony operation. I really like what Mike King does in Portland, OR. Most of his posters are offset, 10 or 2 colors, 11 x 17 format. And once in a while, he splurges with a silk screen. I'll probably do 4 or 5 of the posters in this series silk screen, you know, just to make them extra special. Plus I wanted to still have the time to be able to do posters for other venues. Tower City is a great venue, but just because of it's sheer size (approximately 8000 capacity) most of the bands playing there want no part of splitting on a merch deal with the posters, not to mention my musical tastes run more towards punk rock. Only punk show there is the Warped Tour, which will definitely be one of the "special" screen printed posters. Plus I'm picking up some tour poster stuff and I'm close to a deal right now with one band in particular to do a whole crapload of stuff - more details will be coming when I know the scope of it. I know a lot of artists out there are shipping out finished art to places like Diesel Prints and letting them do the printing, but it's just not economically feasible for me to do that. Plus, as I said, I kinda like the whole telephone poll poster look.

BK: Related to the Tower City thing, how did your relationship with Belkin Productions (Clear Channel in Cleveland) develop and can you talk a bit about what it's like to deal with such a large promoter?

SC: You hear all the cliches about them (Clear Channel) being the great Satan. Maybe in other markets or other tentacles of their business reach (definitely radio), but I know what I have experienced has been great. My whole relationship with Belkin/Clear Channel has been right place/right time. Started out with the Odeon posters. I happened to be in the office there one day and in walked the ops director for the amphitheater. We started talking and before I knew it, bam. I was doing stuff there. It was supposed to be a few posters for a few shows, but it quickly grew. It actually got to the point where one band, a long time veteran of the biz and I'm sure the subject of quite a few posters for their shows over the years, was offended when they didn't get a poster for their show. It was one of those things where I had 4 shows in 5 days deals and plus I'm just not a huge fan of the southern hippy rock thing, so I passed on it. Well their tour manager was a friend of another tour manager who got a poster earlier in the summer. But they will get one of the "special" posters this year. But as I said, they are super nice people. It really is like a large family. Many of the employees have been with the company for upwards of 15 years. This year I did the laminates for the season plus I know about everybody who works there, from security to vendors. They let em set up a tent at some of the bigger festival type shows. I can come and go as I please - what more could a guy ask for? The only problem is that it is such a big company, with each venue having it's own management and the main office with it's own group, sometimes not everybody is on the same page. Had an incident last fall, I did a poster for the White Stripes show at Tower City but it got cancelled due to Jack White's lack of driving skills... When the show was rescheduled, at a different venue, the amphitheater people asked if I was going to redo the poster for the show. So I did. Unbeknownst to me, another poster guy called the home office and made a deal with someone there, and later finds out 2 posters done for the same show. And of course the other artists is screaming and ranting about my "bootleg" poster. But hell, I did the original 4 months earlier. I have no ill will towards the guy. Hell, I'm not that big a fan of the White Stripes. Only reprinted them because they asked me to... but it's all good. No problems to speak of...

BK: Seeing as how you're a fan of the music, how many of the shows that you do prints for do you actually get to attend? Does your car hate you for taking it to Cleveland constantly from Sandusky?

SC: It's been a very slow winter for me for shows. Last year I went to about every show except for the summer shows. Didn't matter if I like or even knew who the band was. It was very cool - got to see lots of different kinds of music. As a result of the shows, I really am into a few bands that I never had a clue about. I'm a fan of Los Straitjackets - they are cool as shit live. Ditto with Steve Earle. Found I can tolerate some of the nu-metal crap out there, but only some of it. I turned out to be a closet fan of 3 Doors Down. I met them at a show in Erie, PA, got invited on the bus, and they were just the nicest, down to earth, un-rock star bunch of guys you could meet! Also became a bit jaded, seeing some of the rock star cliches, especially the pop punk crap. I've actually only been to maybe 3 shows since January. Got some dandies coming up though... Last week was a bitch weather wise. It seemed every show was a trek through a fucking blizzard. The drive itself isn't all that bad, especially in decent weather or after hours though driving home alone at 3 in the morning alone is a bitch. It's only an hour to an hour and 15 to all the venues, but this past winter there were at least 4 or 5 shows that it was a 2-3 hour drive in snow and ice. I drove my old car till the wheel fell off, literally. Pulled into a parking lot one day and snap, crackle, pop - broke the tie rod and ball joint clean off. There's my car lying flat on the ground, and my tire sitting next to it. Sucked! Got a new car and hopefully she won't mind the ride. The first year, when the novelty factor hadn't worn out yet, probably went to 60+ shows easily. Some nights had 2 or 3 shows at different venues. A couple of times actually show-hopped, hitting 2 shows in the same night.

BK: How much freedom do you get when designing your pieces? Given the three motivational forces behind doing a piece, it would be different for each kind, but I wonder about how some pieces have images of the performers directly, some are representations of them, and others are left to "personal inspiration". How often do you get specific requests for a piece is the real question, I guess...

SC: Well, the Clear Channel stuff has to be non-obscene. That is a pretty big rule - no gratuitous nudity, f-bombs, etc. For the most part, other than that, I can pretty much do what I want. Sometimes I do more of an image type poster (such as for Cyndi Lauper) because I'm on a tight time budget and it's sort of a cop-out. Or I just don't know what to do with it (such as the caricature done for Howie Day). Sometimes I really couldn't give a crap and it falls under the "venue is paying me to do it" column. A couple in particular stand out in that column but I won't name names to protect the idiots, er I mean the innocent. A lot of times my best stuff, as is the case I imagine for most poster artists, is for bands I really dig. My Roger Clyne and the Peacemakers series, Motion City Soundtrack, and Pearl Jam pieces are very good examples. Sometimes I might get a few suggestions from someone at a venue, especially if I don't know or care about the band. That's not always a bad thing. I did some really good posters for bands I really didn't know much about at the time and had a little back seat driving instruction on. 3 Doors Down, Mudvayne, and Los Straitjackets are perfect examples. It just depends on the band, the show, the situation, etc. Basically, I don't have that much interference, just a few house rules to live by. Once I was asked to do a poster very low key for a band that the venue had a lot of problems with their fans after a show the previous year. They draw well, so of course they get booked again, but they wanted it kept very low key. I had already done a design for it and had to start from scratch. Ended up using the original art for a different print (for the band X), and it ended up being much more appropriate for them, so it all worked out.

BK: Unlike many artists, you don't sell pieces directly yourself (except at the shows). Is this something you expect will change in the future?

SC: Quite truthfully, I'm too damn lazy to do it. It is a lot of work trying to keep a web site up and running, update it more than once a month, etc. I keep the SBPW site (http://www.sanduskybayposterworks.com) so people can keep informed of what I do, or at least get an introduction to the work. Maybe at some point I'll get to the point where I can have a retail outlet on the web, but right now I don't consider it that high a priority. Plus I'm kinda not very web savvy. Sure I can surf the web, find good porn, buy a case of Jones soda, etc. but I just don't know the web software all that well to build it, especially the whole shopping cart thing. I can basically build a simple web site and that's about it at this point. I will say I've been in discussion with someone for a while now about having them take over the whole web thing. So who knows where it will lead? At some point in the future, it would probably make good business sense to do it, so it'll probably get done in spite of my lack of business sense.

BK: I've heard many collectors talking in the past year (and more) about how the hand-pulled screening process is a dying art in many ways. Can you comment on the feel of a hand-pulled piece VS. the use of mechanized equipment for doing screens? Any thoughts on screen prints VS. offsets? Technique VS. technology?

SC: I've never used a mechanized screen before, so I don't know. I've seen it done on T-shirts but never participated in it myself. Quite truthfully, I really don't have much of an idea of what other people are doing out there right now. I don't have the free time to look around. Occasionally I see something at a show - seen some Enginehouse13 stuff a few times, I liked it plus they're Ohio people! I seem to be getting positive feedback from all the bands, so I must be doing something right. The hand-pulled is a lot more work, and there is something very satisfying about working your ass off on a project and holding it, finished in your hands. Of course, there is also something very satisfying about doing the art, and presto the finished poster appears a week later, and your arms and back don't ache from doing it. Like I said before, I'm branching out, doing some offset, just so I can still be able to do bands I really love and want to do. I have only done 3 of the offset prints and I'm hearing grumbling from people about it. Sorry, only so many hours in the day...

BK: Does the high number of pieces that you tackle ever seem to be a drawback for you? Do you wish that you'd have more time to dedicate to a single piece instead of having to deal with multiple deadlines at once?

SC: Oh yeah... about once a week I wish I had more time to spend on a specific project. I must admit, sometimes a project I really want to do will come up and I'll either weez out or just drop another poster I'm working on. Done it on many occasions. Plus all the different deadlines and venues, sometimes I'm not sure if I'm coming or going. Just got back from a local showcase featuring a bunch of Cleveland area punk bands which I did a poster for and it makes me really want to do more local bands. These kids are busting their butts to get heard and I feel I should help any way I can. But the time frame always seems to be wrong.

BK: With your recent piece for a Cleveland Galactic show, you mentioned to me that you were attempting to imitate the style and feel of some more "classic" concert art. What did you think of the imitation/inspiration experience and do you use this type of process for other pieces that you've done?

SC: It was cool. It helped me in doing the art, because I knew exactly the look that I was going for, which isn't always the case. Had just the opposite happen for the Less Than Jake poster I just finished up on. Wanted to do an old-fashioned wood cut type illustration, circa 14th century. Was looking to have a punky girl being burned at the stake, a la the Salem witch trials, with the townspeople (and members of the band) all chanting "Jen, Jen, Jen". One of my favorite LTJ songs is "Jen Doesn't Like Me Anymore" and they stopped playing it the last few tours. So I was trying to help them excorsize the "Jen" demons. But I couldn't get the look I wanted no matter how much I tried. Eventually just went a complete opposite direction and it was very frustrating to me, probably one of the most frustrating of my mini-career. But I do like the way the new art turned out - I think it's very appropriate for them. Always wanted to do a poster of Lenny Kravitz and remake the famous Jimi Hendrix poster with Lenny's face on it. That would be cool, but I suppose that is the answer to a different question.

BK: What kind of music do you listen to when you're working, driving to shows, falling asleep - what's your personal choice for the best sounds for your ears?

SC: Well, obviously my I-Pod is chock full of punk stuff. I try sometimes to play the band I'm working on to get a feel for their style/sound. Right now the bands I'm really listening to a lot are Motion City Soundtrack from Minneapolis, Roger Clyne and the Peacemakers from Tempe, AZ (not punk), and Less Than Jake from Gainesville Rock City Florida. Just had shows with Motion City and the Peacemakers, and Less Than Jake is next week, so I'm getting them into super heavy rotation. At night, when I'm trying to sleep, no music. A noise machine actually, with white noise static. Can't sleep without it.

BK: Is there any band that you're dying to do a piece for (currently performing or not)?

SC: Well, the Lenny Kravitz poster would be cool. I'm not a huge fan of his, like some of his stuff, but just think it's a cool concept. Actually one I'm really stoked about is Van Halen. When I was a kid, all I wanted to be in life was Alex Van Halen and play a monster drum kit till my ears bled. So when they announced the show I called EVERYONE at Clear Channel and pleaded to do it. Not making a penny off it, not even free tickets. They'll probably never even see it, but I'll know I did it and that's important. A couple other bands I'd love to do posters for are Nine Inch Nails (and that may happen sooner than later) and Goldfinger. They (Goldfinger) were going to be my first poster. Had all the art done for it but didn't have the equipment and know how yet. So hopefully they'll be around this summer or fall. Also NOFX, Descendents, and Green Day would be cool to do.

BK: Do you have your own print collection at home? Are there any other concert artists that you follow and/or are aware of? Any favorite artists (past, present, or future) that serve as visual mentors or inspirational motivators?

SC: My first experience with posters and rock art was the Stanley Mouse stuff he did for Journey back in the 80s. I loved that artwork. Always been a fan of Rick Griffin. Just love all of those old Fillmore posters. My first poster I've ever bought was a Pearl Jam tour poster - bought it framed about 6 or 7 years ago. Don't even know who did it (matting covers it) but still one of my favorites. In my studio I have some COOP's, Kozik's (a lot of Kozik actually), Arminski's, and Uncle Charlie's. Also have a couple of Speed posters. Not a big fan of his, but they were for Less Than Jake, so I had to have them. There is a guy in San Diego I'm kinda fond of - Scrojo - but I don't have any of his work. Also would like to get my hands on a couple of Derek Hess's posters, especially the Hall of Fame concert and the Joey Ramone/Rob Zombie posters but they are a little out of my price range. My 3 pride and joys are a Lindsey Kuhn poster for the Ramones, a double Uncle Charlie poster for Rancid in Texas, and my all-time favorite poster - a Coop poster for the Jon Spencer Blues Explosion -- the JFK assassination poster. I LOVE that poster - it's absolutely fucking genius. The ironic thing is I don't have any of my own prints framed and hanging in my studio. I'm out of room on the walls now and could never figure out which current ones would get the boot...

BK: Any recommendations for the starting artist, especially one that might want to get into concert prints?

SC: DON'T DO IT TO GET RICH!!! Do your homework, spend a little money if you can and get better equipment than I have, and, of course, stay the hell out of Cleveland! Basically just don't think you're going to get rich and be ready to do some work. Oh, and never wear good clothes to print in, and take off your shoes after printing and before walking across the carpet. Also, don't take no for an answer, keep knocking on doors...

BK: Any thoughts on the current state of concert art - where it's been and where it may (or may not) be heading?

SC: From my limited vantage point, it seems like it is in the midst of a revival, especially with the technology of today. Hopefully the old school guys like me won't be left behind. I gotta imagine that there will always be room in the art world for the oddball guy like myself who does their work low-tech. My biggest worry is that bands, and especially record companies, will start cracking down on the biz, blaming us for a drop in sales. I hear rumblings that it's already starting to happen to a few people out there. Too many lawyers and business people in the industry, not enough musicians and artists...

Check out more of Sean's work!

Published on June 6th, 2004